independent and unofficial
Prince fan community site
Tue 19th Feb 2019 5:12am
Welcome! Sign up or enter username and password to remember me
Forum jump
Forums > Prince: Music and More > Article: Michelle Obama recounts difficulty in convincing PRINCE to perform at White House
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Page 2 of 2 <12
  New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
Reply #30 posted 12/14/18 4:18pm

rednblue

Strawberrylova123 said:

EmmaMcG said:



Yeah, that's true. And personally, I only got into Prince after he joined the cult so that never really affected my own personal enjoyment of his music. I knew what I was getting into. But you only have to read a lot of comments on this site and some of his YouTube videos to see that his religion was a turn off for a lot of older fans. Nobody wants preachy rock stars. Thankfully his later work was less religion focused and his appearance on Janelle Monae's album went a long way to compensate for some of his alleged comments about gays. From the outside looking in, it seemed like he was moving away from the stricter values imposed by his religion. Or at least, he realised that in this day and age, potential customers don't like being told they're going to hell for not believing in the same things he believed. Whatever his reason was for laying off the preaching, it was very welcome.

Again! Who cares if his fans liked his religion or not, it's not for his fans to like his personal choice or not. Also JW don't even believe in people being condemned in hell.



I’m guessing that for some fans, the welcome change was about this very thing you point out. In the early 2000’s, he would sometimes “lecture” at concerts, expressing his own like/dislike of fan personal choice.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #31 posted 12/14/18 6:42pm

bashraka

EmmaMcG said:

rogifan said:
Are you referring to JW or religion in general?
Well, in this context, I guess I'm referring to JWs because the quote supposedly came from a JW. But most major religions are guilty of the same thing. My uncle is a priest and even he says he's not comfortable with the "culty aspects" of the Catholic Church. The use of certain phrases, the threats of punishment in the afterlife if you don't obey the rules on Earth, the whole outdated presentation and beliefs (no sex before marriage, no abortions, no gays etc). It seems a shame that someone like Prince, a man who used to celebrate freedom, sexual and otherwise, would get mixed up in such a cult. Not so much for himself, he was a grown man who really should have known better, but when his new beliefs worked themselves into his music, it was his longtime fans who suffered. They bought into this man who championed diversity in all its forms and then he became almost like a parody of those people who "find God" when he started changing his own lyrics and working in lines such as "if you want to be with me ain't no room for disagree". I do feel sorry for him because Larry Graham, as all great cult recruiters do, got to him at a turbulent time in his life.

"They bought into this man who championed diversity in all its forms and then he became almost like a parody of those people who "find God" when he started changing his own lyrics and working in lines such as "if you want to be with me ain't no room for disagree". Fans buy a musician's music not the musician themselves. The entitlement of so many fans who think they can tell what a musician what God to believe in or who to be friends with is exactly why Prince chose to be so private about his life. Fans have the choice to support or not support anyone's art due to their opposition to what a musician publicly advocate for.

3121 #1 THIS YEAR
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #32 posted 12/15/18 12:08am

EmmaMcG

avatar

bashraka said:



EmmaMcG said:


rogifan said:
Are you referring to JW or religion in general?

Well, in this context, I guess I'm referring to JWs because the quote supposedly came from a JW. But most major religions are guilty of the same thing. My uncle is a priest and even he says he's not comfortable with the "culty aspects" of the Catholic Church. The use of certain phrases, the threats of punishment in the afterlife if you don't obey the rules on Earth, the whole outdated presentation and beliefs (no sex before marriage, no abortions, no gays etc). It seems a shame that someone like Prince, a man who used to celebrate freedom, sexual and otherwise, would get mixed up in such a cult. Not so much for himself, he was a grown man who really should have known better, but when his new beliefs worked themselves into his music, it was his longtime fans who suffered. They bought into this man who championed diversity in all its forms and then he became almost like a parody of those people who "find God" when he started changing his own lyrics and working in lines such as "if you want to be with me ain't no room for disagree". I do feel sorry for him because Larry Graham, as all great cult recruiters do, got to him at a turbulent time in his life.


"They bought into this man who championed diversity in all its forms and then he became almost like a parody of those people who "find God" when he started changing his own lyrics and working in lines such as "if you want to be with me ain't no room for disagree". Fans buy a musician's music not the musician themselves. The entitlement of so many fans who think they can tell what a musician what God to believe in or who to be friends with is exactly why Prince chose to be so private about his life. Fans have the choice to support or not support anyone's art due to their opposition to what a musician publicly advocate for.



Yes. I agree. Like I said, I only became a Prince fan after he joined the cult so his religion never bothered me. I'm a big Tom Cruise fan, after all and his devotion to his religion never turned me off him either. But Prince seems to have acknowledged that all the preaching and lecturing he was doing in his music was not good for business. Which is probably why he stopped doing it so much. And because he had stopped doing it, it appeared to many that he was moving away from the JW faith.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #33 posted 12/15/18 2:10am

NorthC

It might be interesting to make a comparison with Bob Dylan here, because he went through exactly the same process in 1979-80: he became a Born Again Christian, performing only his gospel songs on stage preaching hell and damnation in between. To his fans, it seemed as if he was becoming the very thing he (and they) were protesting against in the 60s. And Dylan also toned down his message; all his preaching wasn't going to save anybody if there was nobody left to listen. Maybe it's a phase you have to go through when you become religious: the ones who are receny converted are always the most fanatical
Never try to discourage thinking, for you are sure to succeed.
Bertrand Russell
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #34 posted 12/15/18 4:17am

EmmaMcG

avatar

NorthC said:

It might be interesting to make a comparison with Bob Dylan here, because he went through exactly the same process in 1979-80: he became a Born Again Christian, performing only his gospel songs on stage preaching hell and damnation in between. To his fans, it seemed as if he was becoming the very thing he (and they) were protesting against in the 60s. And Dylan also toned down his message; all his preaching wasn't going to save anybody if there was nobody left to listen. Maybe it's a phase you have to go through when you become religious: the ones who are receny converted are always the most fanatical


I didn't know that about Bob Dylan but that's a very good point.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #35 posted 12/15/18 10:23am

rednblue

EmmaMcG said:

NorthC said:
It might be interesting to make a comparison with Bob Dylan here, because he went through exactly the same process in 1979-80: he became a Born Again Christian, performing only his gospel songs on stage preaching hell and damnation in between. To his fans, it seemed as if he was becoming the very thing he (and they) were protesting against in the 60s. And Dylan also toned down his message; all his preaching wasn't going to save anybody if there was nobody left to listen. Maybe it's a phase you have to go through when you become religious: the ones who are receny converted are always the most fanatical
I didn't know that about Bob Dylan but that's a very good point.


Yes, great to consider! Thanks, NorthC!

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #36 posted 12/15/18 10:31am

Latin

The Grapevine has published the following article entitled "It Wasn't Easy Getting Prince to Perform at the White House, According to Michelle Obama":

https://thegrapevine.ther...831069763/
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #37 posted 12/20/18 10:45am

Latin

pdiddy2011 said:

Thanks for sharing that article.


Its amazing to me that a person can get so lofty in stature that "The White House" has to convince him to come in to perform, and they seemed happy to have the opportunity to convince him.


Absolutely NO SHADE. It's just crazy to think that from such humble beginnings you can reach such heights. P was the man!


You are very welcome.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #38 posted 12/26/18 11:35am

Latin

pinkcashmere23 said:

Interesting! Sounds like a good interview. I'll check it out. Thanks Latin!


You are very welcome. smile
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #39 posted 02/05/19 1:08pm

Latin

andrewm7 said:

thanks for posting this Latin! Also interesting because a lot of the private gigs he played for cash for the ultra wealthy were birthday celebrations

You are very welcome. smile
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #40 posted 02/07/19 4:44pm

tump

Just another musician acting as a political.tool...associating with political filth othe highest order. All politicians are absolute murderous filth who seek associations with pop artists for their PR. All of them. A conscious population would be up in arms about such associations, but they are all asleep.

Millions murdered under their watch...constant wars. Massive war profiteering for the select few. Unpayable debt. Let's dance.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #41 posted 02/07/19 8:53pm

starkitty

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



rogifan said:


ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

The investigation file shows that Larry only saw P twice in the six months prior to his death. Once in March 2016 for Easter services at Kingdom Hall and the Monday before his passing at PP.

I dont think attending services once at KH in six months is exactly something the JW were condoning.





I didn’t think JW observed Easter (or Christmas). confused This from a 2012 interview with the Chicago Tribune: https://www.chicagotribun...story.html And his eyes glisten when he recalls a few words spoken to him at the Jehovah's Witness Kingdom Hall just a few hundred yards down the road from Paisley Park, where he regularly attends Bible study. "I had missed a bunch of meetings because I was on tour, and you know how people like to gossip and talk behind your back? Well, there was none of that," he says. "When I came back, there was one older person there who came up to me. He didn't lay a guilt trip on me. He just spoke with love and compassion, and I'll never forget what he said. 'We just miss you.'" [Edited 12/13/18 23:14pm]



You are correct. JW's dont celebrate "Easter" and Larry called it


"The Memorial of Christ's Death."


So to reiterate, LG only saw P at Kingdom Hall 1x in the six months prior to his passing, and it was at The Memorial of Christ's Death.



LG also told the detective in the 20 years he had known P, P use to go to KH with him 3 times per week. However, in the last 5-6 years he did not see P often.



"The Memorial", as JWs call it, is their most important event of the year and everyone and their mama attends.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #42 posted 02/10/19 9:21am

violetcrush

EmmaMcG said:

bashraka said:

"They bought into this man who championed diversity in all its forms and then he became almost like a parody of those people who "find God" when he started changing his own lyrics and working in lines such as "if you want to be with me ain't no room for disagree". Fans buy a musician's music not the musician themselves. The entitlement of so many fans who think they can tell what a musician what God to believe in or who to be friends with is exactly why Prince chose to be so private about his life. Fans have the choice to support or not support anyone's art due to their opposition to what a musician publicly advocate for.

Yes. I agree. Like I said, I only became a Prince fan after he joined the cult so his religion never bothered me. I'm a big Tom Cruise fan, after all and his devotion to his religion never turned me off him either. But Prince seems to have acknowledged that all the preaching and lecturing he was doing in his music was not good for business. Which is probably why he stopped doing it so much. And because he had stopped doing it, it appeared to many that he was moving away from the JW faith.

I believe Prince was raised within the 7th Day Adventist faith, which is also quite strict in its beliefs. So, he was always connected to the Christian faith in some form or another, and in the earlier days he began to struggle with his very sexual/raunchy music and its contrast to his Christian beliefs. He sang the Lord's Prayer in the middle of the song Controversy in 1982. He added a "conversation with God" in the middle of the song Temptation in 1984/85. He wrote most of an album about choosing God over sex/drugs (LoveSexy) in 1988. He wrote a film and most of another album (Graffiti Bridge) about finding true happiness and salvation through faith in God in 1990. Then he lost his way a bit and seemed to turn to the darker, more sexual side of his music in the early to mid 90's.

*

It is thought that he turned toward religion again after the tragic death of his son. He became friends with Larry Graham during that time, who introduced him to the JW faith. It took several years, but Prince finally officially converted to JW - I believe in the 1999/2000 time frame. He had begun talking and singing about the faith as early as 1997-98.

*

I think when one is feeling lost or struggling as a result of a tragic event in his or her life it is easy to see how focusing on faith in a higher power would provide comfort and peace. In this case, I think JW (via Larry Graham) appeared in the right place at the right time for Prince to become attached and committed to those beliefs. During their 1998 TV appearance on the Sinbad talk show, Larry Graham and Prince discussed their regular bible studies. The group pushes the spreading of their beliefs to non-members:

*

"Jehovah's Witnesses are perhaps best known for their efforts to spread their beliefs, most notably by visiting people from house to house,[213][214][215] distributing literature published by the Watch Tower Society in 700 languages.[216] The objective is to start a regular "Bible study" with any person who is not already a member,[217] with the intention that the student be baptized as a member of the group;[218][219] Witnesses are advised to consider discontinuing Bible studies with students who show no interest in becoming members.[220][221] Witnesses are taught they are under a biblical command to engage in public preaching.[222][223] They are instructed to devote as much time as possible to their ministry and are required to submit an individual monthly "Field Service Report".[224][225] Baptized members who fail to report a month of preaching are termed "irregular" and may be counseled by elders;[226][227] those who do not submit reports for six consecutive months are termed "inactive".[228]"

*

Prince was heavily preaching the JW beliefs in both his songs and discussions during public appearances from 1998 through at least the early 2000's. He was also, unbelievably, doing the door-to-door "witnessing" in Chanhassen. Then at some point he seemed to tone it way down both musically and publicly. I agree that he may have realized he was alienating many of his fans.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #43 posted 02/10/19 9:22am

VioletWaiting

i think michelle obama did a lot of good for our coutry. but i dont care at all about her musical tastes.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #44 posted 02/10/19 9:39am

violetcrush

VioletWaiting said:

i think michelle obama did a lot of good for our coutry. but i dont care at all about her musical tastes.

Well, considering that a person's musical tastes can often, at least on some level, describe who they are, where they came from, or what inspires them I think many would be interested in hearing about her musical interests and/or how various artists played a part in her history.

*

Also, she was being interviewed by a famous musician, so.....not surprising that her musical tastes/interests would come into play during that conversation.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Page 2 of 2 <12
  New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Forums > Prince: Music and More > Article: Michelle Obama recounts difficulty in convincing PRINCE to perform at White House