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Thread started 07/24/19 7:51pm

joyinrepetitio
n

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Thank God for the Vault and Prince's foresight....

How important was it that Prince and Susan Rogers made the vault(s) at Paisley Park. After the incredible fire that wiped out the master recordings of many great artist at Universal in 2008, Prince and the Estate have to count their blessings. How crazy is it when several Universal artist asked for their works only to have Universal make up stories as to why they couldn't find their master reels. Universal held this secret for at least 9 years. It has only recently come to light that the fire consumed works of art that are now lost forever.

Thank you Prince for having the foresight to keep your works under your control! I hope the Prince Estate has made sure Iron Mountain will take care of Prince's works (Children) like he did.

__________________________________________________
2 words falling between the drops and the moans of his condition
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Reply #1 posted 07/25/19 5:38pm

Mikado

I mean, he neglected the Vault to the point where many of the items where damaged and needed intensive restoration, but sure.

Oh, and none of his stuff would have been stored at Universal (where the fire happened in 2008). He was a WMG artist, so it wouldn't have been stored at a competitor's lot.


[Edited 7/25/19 17:38pm]

A certain kind of mellow.
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Reply #2 posted 07/26/19 1:28am

BartVanHemelen

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Meanwhile there are rumors of at least one master tape being in the hands of collectors (because as you guessed it Prince left it at another studio and never picked it up), there's the infamous "Razormaid remix of Housequake" story, and collectors have also said that there are rehearsal tapes that never were sent to Prince (didn't ask for it) which ended up in collectors' hands.

© Bart Van Hemelen
This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights.
It is not authorized by Prince or the NPG Music Club. You assume all risk for
your use. All rights reserved.
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Reply #3 posted 07/26/19 6:25am

Strive

BartVanHemelen said:

Meanwhile there are rumors of at least one master tape being in the hands of collectors (because as you guessed it Prince left it at another studio and never picked it up), there's the infamous "Razormaid remix of Housequake" story, and collectors have also said that there are rehearsal tapes that never were sent to Prince (didn't ask for it) which ended up in collectors' hands.



Forget rumors, one of his studio hired hands walked off with a number of master tapes. That's confirmed.

Prince had no real foresight. He left the most important work of his career in the non-climate-controlled basement while lighting hundreds of candles upstairs. Tape boxes were scattered all over Paisley. The other "vaults" were most likely unsecured warehouses he purchased.

He was incredibly lucky that more of it wasn't stolen or destroyed.
no yesterday or tomorrow, no better remedy for sorrow
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Reply #4 posted 07/26/19 7:26am

jmfd

According to the current Vault archivist M. Howe, very little of the material in the vault was damaged from all those years of sitting in Paisley Park.


The audio tapes, etc. were kept in a climate controled specifically built vault down in the basement of Paisley. After running out space, the overflow of tapes spilled out and were kept in the room adjacent to the vault. So this part of the vault materials, and the video section (kept in a storage room on the top floor of the studios) were not exactly in the ideal environment for many years.

Thus, I would agree, Prince's foresight was not as perfect as we'd like to think it was.

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Reply #5 posted 07/26/19 7:56am

udo

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The way the WarnerBros minions like Michael Howe will treat the Vault will tell a different tale.

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #6 posted 07/26/19 8:04am

savagedreams

not really sure where youre seeing the foresight at. any location can be destroyed. true foresight would be having multiple copies of everything in more than one location.

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Reply #7 posted 07/26/19 8:17am

udo

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One person takes care of the Vault to a certain extent (Prince).

Then another person (Michael) or who is really in charge does not do the true honors to the Vault by releasing what they did in the manner they did it at the times they did it.

I see a stark contrast here.

Taht is all am trying to convey.

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #8 posted 07/26/19 8:35am

BartVanHemelen

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jmfd said:

According to the current Vault archivist M. Howe, very little of the material in the vault was damaged from all those years of sitting in Paisley Park.

.

Except he's since then said other things. Those early comments were obviously "damage control".

.


The audio tapes, etc. were kept in a climate controled specifically built vault down in the basement of Paisley.

.

Where the airco was on the fritz and where they had water leaking in.

© Bart Van Hemelen
This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights.
It is not authorized by Prince or the NPG Music Club. You assume all risk for
your use. All rights reserved.
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Reply #9 posted 07/26/19 1:57pm

jmfd

^ The only place water leaking was an issue would be the video storage room up on the top floor. It's very evident from the pictures the police took of the location, plastic tarp materials hanging from the roof and water stains in certain spots.

However the actual audio vault material was quite dry way down below in the basement.

And yeah, you are correct. The A/C does have a history of going out. I was there for one episode back in 2002. It was toasty hot up on the main soundstage.

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Reply #10 posted 07/27/19 3:42am

udo

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Another way of writing the core issue here is perhaps:

Let's see when the Estate tops a release like Eye's Purple Underground volume Eight, subtitled I'm Gonna Kick Your Ass.

This release has recordings from 17 June 1987 at the Bercy in Paris, France and some rehearsal recordings.

.

They can top it in the number of discs, the amount of audio in minutes, the rarity of things, the artwork in the jewelbox, the info in the booklet in the jewelbox, the price and perhaps more ways.

.

And no: I do not know how I obtained this set. It suddenly sat in the pile of discs.

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #11 posted 08/10/19 4:06am

udo

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To see how it can be done, check out this site.

There's limer notes.

There's an essay.

The site looks well made with nice design and aestethics.

Interesting live material and probably an affordable price.

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #12 posted 08/10/19 5:03am

Chastity

BartVanHemelen said:

Meanwhile there are rumors of at least one master tape being in the hands of collectors (because as you guessed it Prince left it at another studio and never picked it up), there's the infamous "Razormaid remix of Housequake" story, and collectors have also said that there are rehearsal tapes that never were sent to Prince (didn't ask for it) which ended up in collectors' hands.

Many master tapes and recordings are in the hands of collectors. I'm not going to promote specific bootlegs but one comes to mind: "30 Years of Unreleased Funk". 3 volumes. Free.

I bet those came from The vault or from WB. That makes me think they have more. Of course those recordings were offered for FREE in the community. Maybe the next batch will be too.

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Reply #13 posted 08/10/19 6:45am

mbdtyler

Mikado said:

I mean, he neglected the Vault to the point where many of the items where damaged and needed intensive restoration, but sure.



Oh, and none of his stuff would have been stored at Universal (where the fire happened in 2008). He was a WMG artist, so it wouldn't have been stored at a competitor's lot.


[Edited 7/25/19 17:38pm]


Better to lose masters to your own negligence than someone else's, right? lol
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Reply #14 posted 08/10/19 9:10am

olb99

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I don't want to defend Prince, here, but many master/original tapes for other artists/labels have been lost, damaged, etc. Ask any engineer/archivist and she/he will have horror stories to tell.

.

Of course, it doesn't happen only in the music industry. One of the most well know examples is the Doctor Who missing episodes.

.

And, believe me, even in 2019, we're still losing important recordings/documents/data every day.

.

This doesn't excuse Prince's negligence, but he's in good company.

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Reply #15 posted 08/10/19 6:17pm

macaylasdad

jmfd said:

^ The only place water leaking was an issue would be the video storage room up on the top floor. It's very evident from the pictures the police took of the location, plastic tarp materials hanging from the roof and water stains in certain spots.

However the actual audio vault material was quite dry way down below in the basement.

And yeah, you are correct. The A/C does have a history of going out. I was there for one episode back in 2002. It was toasty hot up on the main soundstage.

if the vault was in the basement...just curious how a leaking roof could penetrate 2 floors down in to the vault? Water coming from the walls...sure....leaking water pipe? Maybe.

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Reply #16 posted 08/12/19 8:39am

jmfd

^ Macylasdad,

If you re-read my post, you will see that I stated that the only "vault" storage area impacted by water was actually on the top floor, and not the real vault room which is located in the basement.

The top floor storage room contained primarily video, while the true vault room contained mainly the audio archives.

The video storage room on the top floor had water damage from a leaky roof. And that's it.

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Reply #17 posted 08/12/19 3:59pm

macaylasdad

jmfd said:

^ Macylasdad,

If you re-read my post, you will see that I stated that the only "vault" storage area impacted by water was actually on the top floor, and not the real vault room which is located in the basement.

The top floor storage room contained primarily video, while the true vault room contained mainly the audio archives.

The video storage room on the top floor had water damage from a leaky roof. And that's it.

got it....dumb question...is there a blue print of PP that is publuc record?

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Reply #18 posted 08/12/19 7:30pm

jmfd

There is a basic diagram of the floor layout that you can find online, but I believe it only covers the main floor and not the other two floors.

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Reply #19 posted 08/14/19 8:38pm

funksterr

udo said:

One person takes care of the Vault to a certain extent (Prince).

Then another person (Michael) or who is really in charge does not do the true honors to the Vault by releasing what they did in the manner they did it at the times they did it.

I see a stark contrast here.

Taht is all am trying to convey.

yeahthat

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Reply #20 posted 08/15/19 12:52am

TheFreakerFant
astic

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BartVanHemelen said:

jmfd said:

According to the current Vault archivist M. Howe, very little of the material in the vault was damaged from all those years of sitting in Paisley Park.

.

Except he's since then said other things. Those early comments were obviously "damage control".

.


The audio tapes, etc. were kept in a climate controled specifically built vault down in the basement of Paisley.

.

Where the airco was on the fritz and where they had water leaking in.

It wouldn't be in Michael's interests to say that the stuff was not damaged, in fact the opposite is true. He could make out they came to the rescue and use it to justify moving everything to Iron Mountain which worryingly is in a fire risk and earthquake zone.

So if even he says on record that the tapes were OK and not damaged then you can assume they probably were! So it makes the move to Iron Mountain seem more unjustified. More likely it was so they could do what they want with the vault without interference by fans or the family.

The real damage being done now is by Michael and the estate with these slapdash mixes and rush releases which do not follow Prince's vision (not using the best versions available and adding echo to every vocal track in Originals?!?!).

[Edited 8/15/19 0:55am]

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Reply #21 posted 08/15/19 1:00am

TheFreakerFant
astic

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And to the OP, I agree. The fact he made so much material and saved it shows an incredible amount of foresight, so even though he is dead physically, 'new' music will continue to live on for years and years. It's almost as if he knew he didn't have long and felt compelled to get everything down as quickly as possible. Thank God he did, i think in this sense he was incredibly altruistic and dedicated. I feel lucky to be a Prince fan when I think of this.

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Reply #22 posted 08/15/19 6:30am

jmfd

^ I disagree with one item you stated above.

The move to the Iron Mountain facility was a good one.
That place is is no danger of burning down whatsoever.
I've seen the building up close and it's built like a fortress bunker, much like the ones the Germans built in WW2 in Hamburg and Berlin.

I can't verify it's safe from earthquakes, but I would say that it would take nothing much short of an A-bomb to bring that building down.

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Reply #23 posted 08/20/19 9:18am

TheFreakerFant
astic

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^ No doubt the same was said about the Universal vault that went on fire. The fact is it is in a well known earthquake and fire risk zone.

[Edited 8/20/19 9:19am]

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Reply #24 posted 08/20/19 9:45am

jmfd

Agree to disagree.

Quake, yes. Fire, not as likely.

And the Universal "vault" was not much more than a warehouse (Building 6197) used as such.

Nowhere near the construction of the Iron Mt. facility.

[Edited 8/20/19 9:49am]

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